There are two pamphlets, one depicts the devil (as a representative of the Catholic Church) giving out communion. The other appears to show a dying man of the Catholic faith not going to heaven because he isn't "saved".
Preacher Jonathan Hatcher of Conner Heights Baptist Church says the pamphlets are used to teach what they believe.
Say what?
They believe the devil works for the Catholics? I do actually believe I've heard about the second issue, just never directed towards a different specific faith, just in general. In fact, there was an "Everybody Loves Raymond" show where Ray's Dad said Ray wouldn't go to heaven because Ray doesn't go to church. Ray's fictional family is Catholic. Never heard any Catholics say Baptists wouldn't go to heaven because they aren't confirmed after baptism. But, what the hey, maybe they do say that. It's been a long time.
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Catholics consider all
Catholics consider all baptized people Christians. The statement is actually made during the Mass every time it is served. The difference is the communion practice. To be in communion with the Roman Catholic Church (this meaning God, the priests, and all other confirmed/committed Catholics) is to take communion (wine and bread) believing that the host is transfigured (becomes actual physical body and blood of Christ) during the Mass. Catholics do not believe that people who are not Catholic go to Hell for being Catholic. They believe that people who are baptized and live as Christians go to Heaven, with the Sacraments as interfaces to God as a way to guide one to a Christian life.
I am not Catholic, but my wife is a very regular and devout believer.
The Baptist obsession with Catholicism is both funny and disturbing. It is funny in that it is woefully misinformed. It is disturbing in the extreme lengths that they will go to make their points. I actually had a very anti-papist friend who is a born-again Baptist say that Catholic Masses don't even mention Jesus's name and all of that Latin gobbledy-gook covers up a Satanic ritual. The guy has a degree from Duke. Umm, Mass is served in the language of the area the parish is in. If you are in TN, it is served in English (and Spanish too at a different time). Churches actually have to get special permission to do the Tridentine High Latin Mass these days and have had to for a long time.
That being said, if they were to come to a Catholic service, they would hear learned discussion about a specific message from the Bible each week by a person, the priest, who has given up everything to serve God (yes, there are problems in the priesthood that the Church hasn't even come close to fixing up to and including the abuse scandals). If you come to Immaculate Conception, staffed by Paulist Fathers, you get to hear Father Joe Ciccone who is one of the best preachers you will ever encounter. That's right. He preaches. There actually is a sermon (called the homily) every Sunday.
Often, the only reason I go to Church with my wife (I am skeptical of organized religion of all types), is to hear Father Joe. If preachers are meant to get people in the pews to hear the Good News, he's doing his job.
Hatcher admitted in an
Hatcher admitted in an interview that he knows nothing about the Catholic Church but says that is not necessary because 'the people who wrote the tracts do'.
He probably has coffee with that guy at the Hilltop Baptist Church who displayed the hate sign over in Newport. That's the one where a worship service was interrupted recently when the preacher's angry ex shot his pulpit.
Oh no! Not Alberto!
So psyched to know the awesome and insane Jack T. Chick is still alive and producing his mad comix. I grew up Catholic in East Tennessee, and I've been following Chick's crazy "tracts" for most of my almost 45 years. The first time I saw one was at a very young age when visiting my maternal grandmother's Baptist church. Garden variety fundie hellfire and brimstone preaching, basically. Chick initially illustrated his tracts, but as he gained popularity through the 70s he got more sophisticated and began publishing glossy comic books with the aid of a trained artist (whose name I don't recall, but you can find out all this stuff in the webs). When I was preparing for Confirmation, the "Alberto" comics were released, telling the story of an ex-priest who learned the Evil Truth about us papists and repented. My favorite scene is Alberto saying goodbye to his dying mother, a pious woman who nonetheless goes straight to hell for her lifetime of good works.
Jack T. Chick is, I think, still alive though very old, and his batshit crazy "tracts" as he calls them have generated a cult following among nonbelievers, particularly the young and ironic. No hipster girl's nightstand drawer set is complete without a copy of the Unbearable Lightness of Being, a postcard with Che Guevara's picture, and the Chick tracts her ex-boyfriend left behind.
It's kind of precious to know some fundamentalists still take that stuff seriously, but its wider appeal is, no doubt to Chick's dismay, purely for shits and giggles.
Sectarian hatred
A couple of years ago, on a visit to family in Tennessee, I drove alone from Nashville to Knoxville, randomly sampling the radio dial. The continued virulence of hatred of Catholicism was a surprise to me. I had imagined that a shared hatred of abortion would have united fundies and priests, if perhaps only uneasily. Nope.
Priests don't like the death
Priests don't like the death penalty much either and living one's life as a racist is considered a mortal sin. The Knoxville Baptist Temple has one of its thigh slapper signs out this week saying that Planned Parenthood's founder started the organization to eliminate the "African-American race." Fascinating.
This is the truth about the
This is the truth about the beginning of PPH
You are an idiot.
You are an idiot.
Watch Maafa 21. It's about
Watch Maafa 21. It's about how Planned Parenthood was begun for eugenics reasons and how it targets African Americans and minorities.
Chick's web site. His demons
Chick's web site. His demons are usually depicted grinning lustily at the near-damned and chuckling "Har har!" when sinners don't repent.
http://www.chick.com/default.asp
GOD WILL
TO THE WORLD, IM A MAN OF GOD, AND ON A MISSION TO SPEAK THE TRUTH. IM AFTER THE ENEMY THAT TOOK CONTROL OF PEOPLES MIND, 2 CHRONICLES 7:14 AND LUKE 1:17. THIS IS THE SEASON TO PLANT THE SEED OF FAITH AND HAVE A POSITIVE MIND. THANK YOU AND GOD BLESS
I wondered how long it would
I wondered how long it would take.
I get it
This seems to be the problem here. He thinks everybody shares one mind.
So says the Shepherd. So says
So says the Shepherd. So says the Flock. It would be very interesting to see how many Tea Party Freedom Fighters follow that exact maxim....
Okay, folks. Let's not
Okay, folks. Let's not confuse conservative political views with anti-Catholic views. If you want people to think you're "enlightened", you'd do well to avoid the trap of dropping "everyone that doesn't think like you" into the same bucket. Have a great day.
Let's not get the tea party
Let's not get the tea party freedom fighters alligned with mr. never studied the Catholic Church Mr. hatcher.
Conner Heights Baptist Fool
Why must Christians - Baptist, Catholic, whatever, continue to berate, criticize, and even hate, or spread hateful things about fellow Christians?
When will recognize how much we have in common and STOP fighting and hating each other?
One more reason many people leave organized churches. Like politicians, some pastors and priests don't get it.
The moron pastor of Conner Heights Baptist Church should apologize to his fellow Christians but more importantly - ask God to forgive him for spreading hate.
Check your history, protestants
The "Word of God" you profess to proclaim to the world, and whose literal translation you claim to follow so much more faithfully than the Catholics was assembled in 325 AD during the Council of Nicaea by the very Catholics you attempt to undermine.
The one true church was founded by Christ when he named St. Peter as Pope. The "cookie" made fun of in this hate-filled tract, and the sacramental wine that rounds out the Catholic Holy Eucharist, is a sanctified ritual performed under direct order of Christ to the Apostles, including the first Pope. It is symbolism that certainly holds more weight in faith that snapping off the corner of a Manischewitz cracker and doing a shooter from a thimble-full of Welch's grape juice. Christ never told the Apostles to make pancakes in memory of him either, but that seems to be more important to protestants than actually understanding the roots of Christianity.
Martin Luther, and every other protestant who branched off from his faithless act of selfishness and sectarian greed, are the true heretics. And no amount of plunging yourselves in the fetid baptismal pools of your unsanctified Sunday-morning excuses for IHOPs is going to "save" the blots on your souls handed down by your heretical founders.
True heresy
Ah, the bigotry of the other extreme now represented here too...
Maybe they can both go back to condemning my truly heretical atheist ass.
Disagree
Not another side of bigotry but an actual historical fact. To what facts can you pin your "atheism?"
One actual historical fact - that I didn't disagree with...
Then there's this:
Martin Luther, and every other protestant who branched off from his faithless act of selfishness and sectarian greed, are the true heretics.
When you allege selfishness and greed, do you mean when Luther objected to the thoroughgoing corruption of the Catholic Church of the time, including the selling of forgiveness? Do you advocate a return to burning the rest of us at the stake? Or just torture and sectarian warfare?
Human institutions are inevitably flawed. The Church has been flawed in the past. It is now. The holy spirit doesn't actually intervene to keep ex cathedra statements infallible, any more than it intervenes to keep children from being raped by priests who have been relocated from other similar crime scenes by their ecclesiastical enablers.
There's no evidence that god exists. That's why I'm an atheist.
Still, the regulars here, including me, were defending Catholics against a tradition of sectarian hatred from some extreme Protestants. Are you trying to make us regret that? Tough, we're too principled to be put off by one Catholic anti-Ecumenist.
You're argument is no
You're argument is no different from a theist's argument. It only lies in reverse. I think most atheists don't object to a notion of the divine or sacred, they object to things like Christendom. They might not connect with the notion, but the objection to Christendom is a valid objection.
Note: Martin Luther was a nasty anti-Semite.
Isn't it different? It's not
Isn't it different? It's not a faith-based argument.
As I understand divine, it's hard to see how an atheist could credit divinity. True, we don't object if others believe, though some of us also don't feel obliged to feign credulity at the specifics of others' faiths. So I don't find it credible that Mary was a virgin, and I know for a fact that, despite wars having been fought over it, the host does not become the actual body and blood of Christ (though there's that for us in the liturgy that could be an escape clause).
Anyway, Martin Luther was many things, plus and minus. That's easy for me to cope with; he was a human and no saint. In any case, being a nasty anti-Semite didn't firmly distinguish him from the Church he rebelled against.
coodos to the teen
this teen that got handed the phamplet at school did the right thing, she stood up for what she belived in and did the right thing by telling peopl this child should be told that.. and im on fr.flahertys side.. we shouldnt put down another religion, but accept them for them.. they need who they want to be and not trying to change that...
This is why I left the Baptist church...
Sadly, after 35 years of worship in Baptist churches here in TN, I left the church because of exactly this type of behavior. I personally witnessed preachers, deacons and even fellow worshippers denigrate and smear other religious views, particularly Catholicism.
A word of advice to those folks: you're preaching to the choir when you're talking among yourselves and the rest of the world thinks you're a bunch of nuts. Any way you slice it, you lose when you pull these types of stunts.
Oh, and even though Mike slid into a rather colorful description of the Lord's Supper, he's correct on his history. I encourage all of my Baptist friends to go do the research on the Council of Nicaea as well as the Protestant Reformation and construction/deconstruction of the bible.
I've always wondered how many staunchly rigid Protestant believers are so convinced that their beliefs and practices are the only acceptable form of worship when their religions were formed 1500 years AFTER the death of Christ...without benefit of oral traditions and writings that had been practiced by the Church since the earliest days of Christianity.
No...I have not joined the Catholic faith, but have visited a couple of Methodist churches. Still trying to find that balance of being open minded enough to realize that I don't have all of the answers (and neither do you), but not so open minded that my brain falls out. :-)
This is great an opportunity to teach the Faith.
You shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free.
Ah, but if only the truth
Ah, but if only the truth involved some facts and critical thinking...But then that would take a miracle.
Some things never change
Webster's dictionary...Christian... One who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ. Its 2010 get over it you haters. Leave the competition for the track.
I am not going to quote
I am not going to quote scripture but will let the reader decide for themselvse what te passages mean. I would first ask Mr.Hatcher if he knows the Bible's definition of faith. The Bible is very clear on that(he can ask me if he does't know) Secondly I would refer him to james 2:14. I would also refer him to james 4:12, and also of probably most importance here would be james 4:11. Religion and Politics are the two most fought over and debated things since the beginnings of man. Terrible wars have been fought over them and Mr. Hatcher has fired up with his tounge a type of war that has been waged against Catholics. Not with guns or bullets but with words which is the most dangerous weapon there is. I was made aware of the disgusting pamplets at a Knights of Columus meeting last week.Those not familiar with the Knights of Columbus should know they do a tremandous amount of charity work in the community but are low key about it, and Yes we strive to do good works but have faith that we are called by Jesus Christ himself to do so, otherwise who would answer the call but the faithful? I have pity on Mr. hatcher's young followers because they have not yet had enough years to read, study and understand other faiths. I believe Mr. Hatcher is stirring up hatred against a group of people whom he really should be rallying up with to fight the real evil in the world. I as a Catholic am appalled at his irrisponsible actions and his twisted notions, In his own words according to the Mountain press article last week ha stated "The way I look at it, when churches have problems it ought to ba handled between them rather then brought to a public forum" But he did not do so, he instead handed out hate literatue using young people to do so. I think that wrong and narrow minded. It is this kind of hatred thata was kindled against the jews that led to such disgusting atrocities during the great war. For those who think I am going overboard or over exagerating mybe so, but the greatest oak tree in the forest started as a little seed and Mr. hatcher has not sown an oak tree he has sowed thistles. I hope people will see the trash he believes in and ignores him and all people with such attitudes.
I have a feeling that all these haters in Christian clothing...
When they arrive in Heaven (if they arrive there at all) will find that JC will be quoting himself and saying..."Get thee behind me thou workers of iniquity. I never knew ye." Or words to that effect.
I have found the enemy and the enemy is me.
Does this so-called Pastor actually believe that his efforts with these pamplets will bring about the end of his competition, the Catholic Church? Or is it just one more attempt to bring in more "Faithful Followers" based on hatred and lies.
As my man Mr. T says, "I pity the fools"
okay, guys dont go hating on
okay, guys dont go hating on pastor hatcher he was just mis informed bout the catholic religoin yes he was wrong but who hasnt been wrong in there life?
let he who is without sin throw the first stone
No one here is throwing
No one here is throwing stones. The Bible verse you're alluding to was about literal stones that hurt a lot more than feelings.
We're just commenting. Some might say it's our obligation, but in any case Jesus did it.